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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
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    Whatya Do When the Buyer Ignores Instructions and Requests for Info?

    Instructions for this deal were "Payment by wire transfer only to my bank account."

    Response 1: Buyer sets up Escrow.com transaction. FAIL.

    Response 2: Buyer sends fund by ACH, not wire.

    The problem with ACH is, that unlike wired funds, ACH transactions (to my understanding) are more readily reversed, e.g., stolen credit/debit card, account that approved transfer was actually "hacked", etc. In most/all wired funds transactions you have to show up at the bank, have funds in your account, show ID, sign authorization to transfer funds, etc.

    I asked for account info on "wire transfer". This was ignored. Sent, instead, a "confirmation #". When bank couldn't confirm in inbound wire I dug deeper to find it was an ACH transfer.

    Also, given the "I don't know you" nature of the buyer I conditioned the transfer on a "2 step" = Buyer sets up a Moniker acct, I push domain, buyer can do what they please after that. Why this route? Hmmmm . . easier for me to confirm that I did, indeed, "deliver the goods".

    Last/worst, buyer uses a HotMail account to do business. Uses an "actual name", which name also appeared on the fund transfer, so it's not entirely spooky, but it's not too hard to open a Hotmail account to match a stolen credit card name . . so . .

    So, what do YOU do when someone just doesn't do the deal as the deal was laid out?

    The buyer could be a bona fide purchaser, through and through, but he just hasn't done himself any favors by how he has proceeded.
    Going fishing, soon, I hope.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    I don't sell if they won't agree to my terms. Not worth the risk. It's not rocket science to complete an escrow transaction (he doesn't even have to set it up the seller can) or a wire transfer - sounds a bit dodgy to me.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
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    Woodbury, New Jersey
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    Rob, "dodgy" is probably the perfect word, as in "dodges instructions", "dodges providing information", etc.

    In such situations my instincts are all going against proceeding, even though it "appears" that funds have now been sent.

    I just followed up with a request for a physical address, a land line and a copy of the last account statement for the account that was used.

    It's a shame. It "could" be a person who just isn't used to doing business . . but I checked the email addy and according to DTools there are some 1,000+ domains registered "to this ID".

    Baffling. Entirely self-defeating methods.
    Going fishing, soon, I hope.

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    If you have another bank account I would be tempted to funnel the funds into it before handing over the domain. Assuming that ACH is reversible of course.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Prior To Your Mind
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    Cranky, I am sorry to hear you are going through this.

    This is probably old news to you, and it may not help with your present transaction, but I thought I would mention it just in case.

    I got tired of dealing with this type of buyer, especially those from outside the U.S., so I began insisting on either Sedo or Moniker escrow.

    If the buyer does not agree to this reasonable condition, then the deal is off.

    Sedo does it for 3 percent if the deal was made off their website, and Moniker's fees are modest.

    To me, the escrow fees are worth the peace of mind and the time saved, and you can split the fees 50-50.

    You also avoid the scammers by insisting on Sedo or Moniker escrow.

    Moniker escrow has not been as responsive the last two times I have used them, but Sedo is usually good.

    Best,
    David

    http://sedo.com/us/services/domain-escrow/

    https://www.moniker.com/aftermarket/domain-escrow.jsp
    Last edited by electronic; 02-24-2010 at 03:26 PM.
    Freedom is the only moral system of government. Democracy and Freedom are not synonymous. Popular political discourse is no more than debating how to arrange the deck chairs on the Titanic. Vote Libertarian. Go to LP.org.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Woodbury, New Jersey
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    Thanks for the "sympathies", David, and for the suggestion.

    I've used Escrow services in the past but I've had it with people asking to do business with me only to tell me - implicitly - that they don't trust me.

    "No, you can't have my money . . we believe you have it in you to be a thief! Escrow! Escrow!"

    My current response is "You don't trust me? Well, I don't need your money. Good-bye."

    Most folks I've dealt with get over the need for escrow pretty quickly. In my case, it's not like I'm a shaddowy individual with a bad reputation . . . excepting, perhaps, my reputation for sometimes being a bit . . cranky.
    Last edited by CrankyOldMan; 02-25-2010 at 01:57 AM.
    Going fishing, soon, I hope.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    I think not using some form of escrow service in this industry is dangerous given the ease with which domains can be moved. It's very easy to get ripped. I've never had an escrow deal go sour yet I have been ripped off a couple of times on lower-value sales via paypal and 'trust'. I don't think requesting an escrow transaction is evidence of mistrust - it's just good business sense.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Prior To Your Mind
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    Cranky, I would not request escrow with folks I know, or with those who have a known reputation such as you or Rob.

    But, for transactions with unknown persons, especially from outside the U.S., then escrow does not seem unreasonable, and it takes the worry out of the sale or purchase.

    I cannot presume to tell you how to react to a request for escrow, and can only speak for myself: If the other party does not know me and does not know that my word is my contract, then I understand and move forward with escrow.

    I blame the very need for escrow on those without integrity, and not on the person making the request for escrow.
    Last edited by electronic; 02-25-2010 at 12:45 AM.
    Freedom is the only moral system of government. Democracy and Freedom are not synonymous. Popular political discourse is no more than debating how to arrange the deck chairs on the Titanic. Vote Libertarian. Go to LP.org.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Woodbury, New Jersey
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    2,181
    Hmmm . . . I guess what I'm describing is an artifact, of the fact, that it's been awhile since I last made a major aftermarket purchase myself.

    I'm mostly talking about my experience, of late, on the sell side.

    Insisting on an escrow if the person selling (I'm buying from) is a total unknown isn't a bad idea, especially an overseas unknown, but when you/I are the person soliciting the sale of a domain that wasn't "advertised" for sale, we can only make escrow a condition of sale if the seller is willing. If he/she isn't willing then, absent evidence/signs of integrity, sure . . walk away.

    I've been around too long and too visible for anyone to say "But . . but . . you're an unknonwn . . " At least that's my take on the situation. (Imagine me telling Ron Jackson or Snoopy or Rick that "We can only do business if someone else I trust holds the money". I can't.)

    There comes a time and a place, in the course of dealing with people, when it must - or ought to - be said/true/acknowledged that, for those involved, "My reputation is worth more than this sum of money".

    Ahh . . . too much heady BS. It's always a matter of "Deal or no deal!"
    Last edited by CrankyOldMan; 02-25-2010 at 02:17 AM.
    Going fishing, soon, I hope.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    10
    yup..true,,i am agree with you.

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