RL.com was not stolen 3 years ago, it was stolen approximately 8-9 months ago. Of course your due diligence resulted in a clean bill of health for the domain, you asked a public relations spin doctor! I'm not saying you did anything wrong, you had no way of knowing the domain was stolen.

However, now I am willing to provide you with proof that the domain was stolen.

FACT: I have records, such as domain renewal notices, that show it was registered till 2005.

FACT: Sometimes even domains that are registered for many years, get deleted by NSI. This never happened with RL.com, or every chaser would have known about it.

FACT: The former owner [Dale Mayberry] is furious about his domain being stolen. I can provide you with his contact information, should you wish to talk with him.

FACT: the admin email domain [MAT.net] expired, and was registered by some company supposedly in China. To this day, the domain has been stripped clean of WHOIS information. Clearly a fraudulent registration.

FACT: One of your own friends brought this domain to your attention as stolen!

Under these circumstances, even attempting to sell the domain is just irresponsible.

My options at recovering the domain are limited, due to NSI's incompetence, but I plan on continuing to try.

As I stated, I have re-initiated a due diligence on this domain. I have proof that the name was purchased "in good faith"......through the world famous Escrow.com folks - the so called independent safe agent of domain escrow transactions......!

In any case, if you can forward to me any all documentation about this situation, I promise to look into this issue further. You have my word. Fax: 954-969-9155.

Thanks,

Originally posted by mcahn
wlsSelfPromotion,

Self Promotion? What have we been promoting here except give honest and non-selfpromotional opinions to The Columbian for which he has already expressed his thanks?

Fact - NSI's average domain loss due to fraud and theft is more than 25 domains each month.

You seem to be under the impression that if you keep repeating a statement it becomes a fact. What is the source of this statement? Are you willing to sign an affidavit to this effect and are you willing to defend yourself if NSI takes you to court for making false and damaging allegations?

Fact - NSI does not have an independent escrow account that they use for Certified Offer, They authorize credit cards up front then send a message to the registrant - escrow is not even involved.

Even if you refuse to read the details of their program use a little common sense. How does the payment go from the Buyer to the Seller. Buyer's credit card is charged and then how does the payment get to the Buyer, by magic?

NSI charges the Buyer's credit card, takes the funds (not merely authorizing - what good is that?), instructs the Seller to perform the required work to complete the transfer and then sends a check to the Buyer. That is what is called escrow service.

Fact - Certified Offer is not an escrow program, it is a domain acquisition program for interested parties to make offers on registered domains.

Neither Certified Offer nor Domain Systems are escrow programs per se. They both provide services related to the trade of domain names and provide escrow services as part of the transactions to handle the transfer of funds. Unlike Escrow.com which solely provides escrow services both of your services are similar in that they require the transfer of the domain name from their existing registrars to your own along with the escrow service.

Fact - NSI does not have an independent domain change of ownership escrow account where names are held neutrally while ownership and funds are being handled.

There is no need for an independent domain change of ownership escrow account if ownership transfers from the Seller to the Buyer. Does eBay place property under its own title when conducting transactions? Do real estate companies take title of a house pending completion of the transfer?

Once again you are projecting an illusionary sense of security for your policies and claiming to have invented a revolutionary new process which no one else has had the ability to think of.

The proper way of doing such transactions, as everyone else does in the business, is to handle the transfer of funds BEFORE and change title afterwards. Once funds have cleared the transfer occurs from the Seller to the Buyer.

Fact - I am not the President of Moniker - I am the Founder and CEO - not that it matters.

You are correct, your are the founder and CEO, you have been signing your emails to us in the past as:

Monte Cahn
Founder/CEO

Monte@Moniker.com
Monte@DomainSystems.com

O - 954-984-8445
F - 954-969-9155

www.Moniker.com - ICANN Accredited Corporate Domain Management Services
www.DomainSystems.com - Domain Sales & After-market Services
www.CoolHandle.com - World Class Hosting and Email Solutions

Dragon,
Lets get your friend Dale Mayberry on board at DS and start a new thread relating to the stolen domain name.
Some of us here have first hand experience with stolen names and can assist in getting it back.
Remember it is much easier to do this while the name is registered with the current Registrant (Tiger-CDM aka Coorg Network - coorg.net aka CCN India - ccnindia.com) an apparent Directi reseller. You can imagine how much harder it will be if Ralph Lauren bought the name for a million dollars and you had to go after them instead.
Keep in mind that dealing with an Indian Registrar will make it even harder due to jurisdictional issues. There is precedence for foreign registrars not abiding with US court decisions for handing over domain names. In similar stolen domain name cases US registrars have returned domain names to the previous registrar when an indemnification document has been presented to the receiving registrar but that is solely at the discretion of Directi in this situation.

Originally posted by wlspro
Dragon,
Lets get your friend Dale Mayberry on board at DS and start a new thread relating to the stolen domain name.
Some of us here have first hand experience with stolen names and can assist in getting it back.
Remember it is much easier to do this while the name is registered with the current Registrant (Tiger-CDM aka Coorg Network - coorg.net aka CCN India - ccnindia.com) an apparent Directi reseller. You can imagine how much harder it will be if Ralph Lauren bought the name for a million dollars and you had to go after them instead.
Keep in mind that dealing with an Indian Registrar will make it even harder due to jurisdictional issues. There is precedence for foreign registrars not abiding with US court decisions for handing over domain names. In similar stolen domain name cases US registrars have returned domain names to the previous registrar when an indemnification document has been presented to the receiving registrar but that is solely at the discretion of Directi in this situation.

What's or Who is preventing YOU from starting another thread?
You are way out of subject here...
I don't think your " quasi-legal' (legal assistant ? ) advice is warranted.
If you are witness to or have some meaningful information please share with us.. . in another thread.

"NSI's average domain loss due to fraud and theft is more than 25 domains each month"

Does Peter Kerrick agree with that figure? If he doesn't, then would you call him a liar?

"managing more than 500K domains"

... which means that if you lost something like three domains a year, you'd be on par with NSI.

"we operate in the most ethical manner and with best intensions"

I appreciate that, which is why pointless raw numerical comparisons with a competitor who is two orders of magnitude larger come off sounding a bit shallow.

"satisfies 99% of both buyer and seller....out of 3,000+ or so sales"

...which means 30 people/year who are not satisfied. Or, for proportional comparative purposes, NSI would have to screw up 250 domains a month to meet that level of satisfaction. :-)

"I have proof that the name was purchased "in good faith"......through the world famous Escrow.com folks - the so called independent safe agent of domain escrow transactions......! "

That's beyond lame, Monte. You know full well that Escrow makes absolutely no warranty that domains sold through Escrow.com are not stolen. Read the Escrow.com terms of service. Thieves PREFER Escrow.com because they don't have to identify themselves beyond providing a bank account number in Badsmellistan.

And the point about conflict is that if you are doing transactions on a percentage instead of a flat non-refundable fee, then you *have* an interest in seeing the transaction go through.

Oh - I am just riding the point that Wlsprofit made before about escrow, ebay, Nsi, FDIC and every other company brought up here.

99% was not accurate. It is actally 99.7444% use our service. 11 sales went through outside agencies.

I know theives use escrow.com....I was just kidding on how secure their systems are. my point is that services like ours are safer for both buyer and seller.

Yes - not only Peter but 3 others have told confirmed their domain losses in some detail to me.

Hope that clarifies things. I will let this thread rest for a while.

Have a great holiday weekend everyone!

John, it's like talking to a wall - only a wall makes more sense

FACT: the admin email domain [MAT.net] expired, and was registered by some company supposedly in China. To this day, the domain has been stripped clean of WHOIS information. Clearly a fraudulent registration.
--

Actually, I don't think mat.net expired.

The current Registrar has a Created date that is not correct. The Registry has the correct Created date:
http://registrar.verisign-grs.com/cg...et&type=domain
Domain Name: MAT.NET
Registrar: BIZCN.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.bizcn.com
Referral URL: http://www.bizcn.com
Name Server: NS1.DOMAINCITY.COM
Name Server: NS2.DOMAINCITY.COM
Status: REGISTRAR-LOCK
Updated Date: 09-oct-2004
Creation Date: 03-oct-1995
Expiration Date: 02-oct-2005

From this we can assume that Mat.net had its Admin Email changed from: dale@mat.net sometime between Oct 29, 2003 and Dec 19, 2003 when it changed at NSI to
Beijing Sinonets Network & Telecom Co.,Ltd. (36648500O)
Room 206-209,Kunming Plaza,
Xiang Lu Ying Tou Tiao Street
Beijing, Beijing 100052
CN
86-1063169899 fax: 86-1063169960
cuike@sinonets.com.cn

So if there was a fraud here, it happened at NSI on Mat.net. Once the hijacker had control of Mat.net, he could order a transfer of registrar over to Bizcn.com which was completed by Jan 16, 2004.

Since then it's changed ownership several times. Who knows if the sales were real or not, or if it's just the hijacker making whois changes.

In any case, is Dale screwed here? Something about "innocent purchaser"? Or is it a game of hot potato and when Dale gets a court order, the last one holding the potato gets no domain and no money while the domain goes back to Dale?

John?

Hi locos,

Thanks for the post.

Expiration dates can be very misleading. I know conclusively that the MAT.net domain expired....I watched it expire and tried to contact Dale to let him know it had expired. I suppose it is theoretically possible that someone renewed the domain and then hijacked MAT.net, but I really feel that is irrelevant as it doesn't change the fact that RL.com was then stolen once MAT.net was under new control.

I'm not sure what you mean by "is Dale screwed here"; since he lost a valuable asset worth 75k I think its pretty safe to say that the thief screwed him. I haven't talked to Dale Mayberry in many months, I have no idea if he is planning on getting a court order or if he has given up on resolving this matter.